Posts by Disillusioned JW

28

Where did Christendom go? They HATED our bible in 1950...just read...

by oompa in

jw
friends

the articles on the jw-cd which only go back to 1950 where we fought back the attacks.

i do not understand why they did not continue to blast our bible since it is such a fraud....down south in usa churches teach members how to refute dubs at their door.....but why did they stop blasting the nwt?

it is sooooooo easy to show a dub there is a bunch of made up crap in it.....i may have to help my local chruches.....if you need more info about the horrible fraud parts, feel free to pm me.........................oompa......even elders dont know

Disillusioned JW

In my previous post I included a link to https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/10440/prof-jason-beduhn-letter-on-nwt-kit-part-2 in which I quoted parts from a post (by bj) of a letter by DeBuhn. That same post by bj also included a second letter from DeBuhn. That second letter commented about the lack of a definite article (regarding theos) in the latter part of the Greek of John 1:1. It said what that signifies, namely "the word" was being said as being in the same category of God, rather than making the claim of being God.

DeBuhn explanation is thus in harmony with the WT's NWT translation of "a god". That agrees with what I read more than 12 years ago in a used textbook (which I found in a thrift store) about NT Koine Greek, in regards to John 1:1 and the meaning of a lack of a definite article in such Greek. [I made that discovery when I still thought of myself as a JW, but one doing critical research regarding the WT's teachings and doing independent research of the Bible.] Namely that the lack of the definite article (regarding theos) in the latter part of the version was making the claim that "the word" was of the same quality or type of being as God, instead of making the claim that "the word" was God (the God). The WT's translation of "a god" accurately conveys that idea, and is thus an accurate translation of John 1:1.

28

Where did Christendom go? They HATED our bible in 1950...just read...

by oompa in

jw
friends

the articles on the jw-cd which only go back to 1950 where we fought back the attacks.

i do not understand why they did not continue to blast our bible since it is such a fraud....down south in usa churches teach members how to refute dubs at their door.....but why did they stop blasting the nwt?

it is sooooooo easy to show a dub there is a bunch of made up crap in it.....i may have to help my local chruches.....if you need more info about the horrible fraud parts, feel free to pm me.........................oompa......even elders dont know

Disillusioned JW

What about the quotes in page 14 of the November 2007 Awake! (in the article called "Which Translation Should I Read?") of Jason David BeDuhn and Dr. Benjamin Kedar regarding the accuracy of the NWT? The topic thread at https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/10440/prof-jason-beduhn-letter-on-nwt-kit-part-2 (in the initial post which contains a letter from BeDuhn) makes a very strong comments by DeBunh in support of the NWT. I am astonished by what that letter says.

See also https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/10361/prof-jason-beduhn-letter-on-nwt-kit-part-1 which in post by GinnyTosken includes a letter from BeDuhn in which BeDuhn says the following.

'I wrote a letter to the WBTS, thanking them for providing copies of the KIT free of charge to my class. I did this as a gesture of appreciation. I also took the opportunity to praise what I found to be the merits of the book. The sections of my letter quoted in the Watchtower accurately reflect my views.

... I used the KIT in a gospels course I taught, because I wanted to point out things that are hard to see in the more commonly available translations. Although the students didn't know Greek, by using an interlinear I was able to show them very subtle things in the text, and introduce them to a few Greek terms that are very important to understand.

... "Atrocious, deceitful, and inaccurate" may be what some call the NWT, but such a characterization is completely erroneous. Nearly every message I have received since the Watchtower article came out has claimed that "all reputable scholars," "every Greek or biblical scholar," etc. has condemned the NWT. It often sounds like people are getting this quote from the same source. But whatever the source, it is a lie. I have looked into the matter, and found almost no reviews of the NWT in academic journals.'

http://www.onlytruegod.org/defense/kedar.htm includes a letter by Kedar about the NWT and that letter praises the Hebrew Scriptures sections of the NWT.

It thus appears to me that the WT's Awake! article did not misrepresent the quotes of scholar DeBuhn and scholar Kedar.

35

Refuting the Alleged Evidence of Jesus' Resurrection

by truth_b_known in

in the past few months there have been a few debates on this site over alleged evidence of the resurrection of jesus.

this can be a hot topic as most would agree that without the resurrection of jesus there would be no christianity.

i am not so sure of that, but i am more sure that dr. gary habermas' minimal facts approach to the resurrection has no evidentiary basis.. here is a 22 minute video on the topic.

Disillusioned JW

The find the ossuary with a symbol of fish and the find in the same tomb of an ossuary with an inscription containing the name Yahweh is very impressive to me. But, for an article which less positive about the finds see https://www.nbcnews.com/science/cosmic-log/doubts-about-jesus-discovery-flna247150 .

35

Refuting the Alleged Evidence of Jesus' Resurrection

by truth_b_known in

in the past few months there have been a few debates on this site over alleged evidence of the resurrection of jesus.

this can be a hot topic as most would agree that without the resurrection of jesus there would be no christianity.

i am not so sure of that, but i am more sure that dr. gary habermas' minimal facts approach to the resurrection has no evidentiary basis.. here is a 22 minute video on the topic.

Disillusioned JW

Pertaining to the two videos (without the JW splice in the 2nd video) I linked to in my prior post there is an article at https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/filmmaker-says-jerusalem-tomb-houses-some-of-jesuss-earliest-followers/2012/04/05/gIQAjCioxS_story.html . It says in part the following.

'The Patio Tomb is similar in structure to the “Jesus Family Tomb.” It consists of small niches dug in limestone that contain ossuaries — small stone boxes designed to hold the bones of the deceased. The most significant discoveries are an inscription in Greek letters on one of the ossuaries and carvings on another.

James Tabor, a religious studies professor at the University of North Carolina at Charlotte who was part of Jacobovici’s team, says the inscription can be understood to mean “God, Jehovah, Raise up! Raise up!” He and Jacobovici interpret this as the earliest statement of faith in resurrection.'

It looks like the name of the full documentary is called 'The Resurrection Tomb Mystery"; see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resurrection_Tomb_Mystery . I hope to find and watch that full documentary.

Many years ago on cable TV (or maybe on PBS) I watched a documentary by Simcha Jacobovici in which Jacobovici said the physical body of Jesus was not resurrected and that his bones were place in an ossuary. In the documentary Jacobovici also said that he believed that the earliest Christians believed that Jesus was resurrected to life as a spirit being (in other words the same teaching in that regard as the WT). In the same documentary a Catholic cleric said the church concluded long ago that Jesus had a bodily resurrection instead of being resurrected as only a spirit.

In a different topic thread I mentioned the view that the early Christians were called Chrestians instead of Christians. A source I read about that view showed pictures of inscriptions in Greek letters, including of the name Yahweh/Jehovah, along with incantations for healing.

35

Refuting the Alleged Evidence of Jesus' Resurrection

by truth_b_known in

in the past few months there have been a few debates on this site over alleged evidence of the resurrection of jesus.

this can be a hot topic as most would agree that without the resurrection of jesus there would be no christianity.

i am not so sure of that, but i am more sure that dr. gary habermas' minimal facts approach to the resurrection has no evidentiary basis.. here is a 22 minute video on the topic.

Disillusioned JW

Video lovers rejoice! The following are links to James Tabor's and Simcha Jacobovici discovery of a 1st century tomb in Jerusalem containing an ossuary with the symbol of fish vomiting a human (the sign of Jonah, which in the Gospels Jesus said would be sign - his resurreection) and an inscription of the name Yahu (Yahweh/Jehovah) in Greek letters! The videos says that the spirit of Jesus was raised up (resurrected) to heaven, with his fleshly body being left behind. That teaching is close to the WT - wow!

Archaeologists finally OPEN the JESUS' TOMB! ʿĪsā Yeshua يسوع

Archaeological Find proves that God's name is JEHOVAH! Amazing!

The latter video says that a phrase (in Greek) used in the Gospel of John is inscribed on the ossuary saying "I am raised up." WOW! The video says the inscription can be translated as "GOD JEHOVAH RAISE UP! RAISE UP!" in an interlinear inscription written in Greek letters (of both Greek and Hebrew words)! [I think the Hebrew words are transliterations into Greek letters, including the name Yahu/Yahweh/Jehovah, and the word meaning "Raise Up!").

Update: The last minute of the video appears to include a audio-video splice by a JW. But the first part of the video is a production of Simcha Jacobovici.

35

Refuting the Alleged Evidence of Jesus' Resurrection

by truth_b_known in

in the past few months there have been a few debates on this site over alleged evidence of the resurrection of jesus.

this can be a hot topic as most would agree that without the resurrection of jesus there would be no christianity.

i am not so sure of that, but i am more sure that dr. gary habermas' minimal facts approach to the resurrection has no evidentiary basis.. here is a 22 minute video on the topic.

Disillusioned JW

James Tabor along with Simcha Jacobovici has a book which I think I never learned of until today, namely The Jesus Discovery: The New Archaeological Find that Reveals the Birth of Christianity. Regarding the discovery mentioned in the book see https://www.eurekalert.org/news-releases/798650 . That website says the following about an inscription which was found (boldface is mine).

'There are engravings on five of the seven ossuaries: an enigmatic symbol on ossuary 2 (possibly reading Yod Heh Vav Heh or "Yahweh" in stylized letters that can be read as Greek or Hebrew, though the team is uncertain); an inscription reading "MARA" in Greek letters (which Tabor translates as the feminine form of "lord" or "master" in Aramaic) on ossuary 3; an indecipherable word in Greek letters on ossuary 4 (possibly a name beginning with "JO…"); the remarkable four-line Greek inscription on ossuary 5; and finally, and most importantly, a series of images on ossuary 6, including the large image of a fish with a figure seeming to come out of its mouth.

... the four-line Greek inscription contains some kind of statement of resurrection faith.

Tabor noted that the epitaph's complete and final translation is uncertain. The first three lines are clear, but the last line, consisting of three Greek letters, is less sure, yielding several possible translations: "O Divine Jehovah, raise up, raise up," or "The Divine Jehovah raises up to the Holy Place," or "The Divine Jehovah raises up from [the dead]."

"This inscription has something to do with resurrection of the dead, either of the deceased in the ossuary, or perhaps, given the Jonah image nearby, an expression of faith in Jesus' resurrection," Tabor said.

35

Refuting the Alleged Evidence of Jesus' Resurrection

by truth_b_known in

in the past few months there have been a few debates on this site over alleged evidence of the resurrection of jesus.

this can be a hot topic as most would agree that without the resurrection of jesus there would be no christianity.

i am not so sure of that, but i am more sure that dr. gary habermas' minimal facts approach to the resurrection has no evidentiary basis.. here is a 22 minute video on the topic.

Disillusioned JW

Regarding Robert Eisenman's book called James the Brother of Jesus: The Key to Unlocking the Secrets of Early Christianity and the Dead Sea Scrolls https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_the_Brother_of_Jesus_(book) says the following.

"The central claim is that Jewish Christianity emerged from the Zadokites, a messianic, priestly, ultra-fundamentalist sect, making them indivisible from the milieu of contemporary movements like the Essenes, Zealots, Nazoreans, Nazirites, Ebionites, Elchasites, Sabeans, Mandaeans, etc.

In this scenario, the figure of Jesus at first did not have the central importance that it later acquired. The canonical Twelve Apostles were no more than an artificially expanded replacement for the smaller circle of brothers of Jesus. After his crucifixion one of his brothers, James the Just took his place as the leader of this party, besides other factions loyal to Jesus (Ebionites) and to John the Baptist (Mandaeans). The central triad of the early Jerusalem Church will be composed by James, Peter, and John the Apostle. According to Eisenman, James was an important religious figure in his own right."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Eisenman says the following.

'As far as Eisenman is concerned, James the Just, the individual Paul actually refers to as either "brother of Jesus" or "the brother of the Lord",[59] is the historical character who exhibits the most in common with "the Teacher of Righteousness" pictured at Qumran and he considers that these events are the ones vividly portrayed in the Habakkuk Commentary. Historically speaking, it is this character who led the "Opposition Movement", including Essenes, Zealots, Sicarii, and/or Nazoreans – even Ebionites – and who, as “Zaddik" (צדיק), i. e., "the Zaddik of the Opposition Movement", about whom all these groups revolved until his death at the hands of the High Priest Ananus ben Ananus in 62 CE as described both in Josephus and Early Church literature.[60] For him, the popularity of James and the illegality of the manner of his death at the hands of the Herodians, establishment High Priesthood, and Pharisees in 62 CE set the stage for and possibly even triggered the First Jewish Revolt against Rome in 66–73 CE – to say nothing of the fire in Rome, not long afterwards which, aside from his probably having set it himself,[dubious – discuss][citation needed] Nero was reported to have blamed on "Christians".'

35

Refuting the Alleged Evidence of Jesus' Resurrection

by truth_b_known in

in the past few months there have been a few debates on this site over alleged evidence of the resurrection of jesus.

this can be a hot topic as most would agree that without the resurrection of jesus there would be no christianity.

i am not so sure of that, but i am more sure that dr. gary habermas' minimal facts approach to the resurrection has no evidentiary basis.. here is a 22 minute video on the topic.

Disillusioned JW

Years ago (probably before I became an atheist) I read sections of the some of the books of Robert Eisenman (a biblical scholar, historian, and archaeologist), including the book called James the Brother of Jesus: The Key to Unlocking the Secrets of Early Christianity and the Dead Sea Scrolls. I think I formerly owned a copy of that book. I also read some articles by biblical scholar James Tabor. At https://jamestabor.com/ebionites-nazarenes-tracking-the-original-followers-of-jesus/ James Tabor as an article called "Ebionites & Nazarenes: Tracking the Original Followers of Jesus".

21

The senseless ''non partakers'' Jesus Memorial

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

matthew 26: 18-20 .

18 he said: “go into the city to so-and-so and say to him, ‘the teacher says: “my appointed time is near; i will celebrate the passover with my disciples at your home.19 so the disciples did as jesus instructed them and prepared for the passover.20 when evening came, he was reclining at the table with the 12 disciples.. only jesus and his 12 disciples were present at the passover .if jesus wanted observers, he would of had some sit down at his last meal and requested that they be present that day and future passovers.

why does the wts feel that observers ( non partakers ) need to attend the yearly memorial?

Disillusioned JW

In the story (which I consider to be fictional) at Deuteronomy 29:10-15 the foreigners are those present at the beginning of the law covenant, not those who came into association with the Jews centuries later. Regarding those foreigners who associated with Jews centuries later the Watchtower of 98 2/1 p.19, par. 6 is correct in saying the following "... foreigners of old laid hold of the Law covenant. In what way? Not by becoming participants in it but by submitting to the laws associated with it and benefiting from its arrangements."

35

Refuting the Alleged Evidence of Jesus' Resurrection

by truth_b_known in

in the past few months there have been a few debates on this site over alleged evidence of the resurrection of jesus.

this can be a hot topic as most would agree that without the resurrection of jesus there would be no christianity.

i am not so sure of that, but i am more sure that dr. gary habermas' minimal facts approach to the resurrection has no evidentiary basis.. here is a 22 minute video on the topic.

Disillusioned JW

Instead of saying "Likewise the Hebrew word Elohim ..." I probably should have said 'In contrast the Hebrew word Elohim ...".